Comments on: Ugly: A Last Note on the Ethiopian Campaign http://www.historynet.com/ugly-a-last-note-on-the-ethiopian-campaign.htm From the World's Largest History Magazine Publisher Wed, 19 Jun 2013 09:48:34 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: jimmypete http://www.historynet.com/ugly-a-last-note-on-the-ethiopian-campaign.htm#comment-822220 jimmypete Wed, 24 Oct 2012 15:03:14 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/?p=13686887#comment-822220 The best overall work is Haile Selassie's War, by Mockler, it's out in paperback, excellent study of the Italo-Ethiopian War and very good study of the British campaign in East Africa during World War Two, I still think that Italian participation in World War Two deserves a stand alone history in English, all aspects naval, military, diplomatic. The best overall work is Haile Selassie's War, by Mockler, it's out in paperback, excellent study of the Italo-Ethiopian War and very good study of the British campaign in East Africa during World War Two, I still think that Italian participation in World War Two deserves a stand alone history in English, all aspects naval, military, diplomatic.

]]> By: Luke Truxal http://www.historynet.com/ugly-a-last-note-on-the-ethiopian-campaign.htm#comment-822219 Luke Truxal Wed, 24 Oct 2012 14:55:08 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/?p=13686887#comment-822219 Good post. Ira Eaker actually discussed strategic bombing and the Ethiopian campaign in either Winged Warfare or Army Flyer. I cannot remember which. I guess that makes me a bad student. Eaker concluded that this war provided a poor test case for the application of strategic bombing. He believed the wide spread attacks against the population was the wrong approach. Eaker argued that using air power as a blunt instrument against the Ethiopians worked, because they did not possess an industrialized economy. In his opinion, the application of high level precision bombing could not be proven against a country like Ethiopia. This provides another reason why the Ethiopian War should be studied. American airmen dismissed it. A European power faced off against what was believed to be an inferior opponent in Ethiopia. Decades later the United States Air Force found itself engaged in a war against a similar opponent in Vietnam. With that said, does anyone know of any books published about the Italian application of air power in the Ethiopian War? Good post. Ira Eaker actually discussed strategic bombing and the Ethiopian campaign in either Winged Warfare or Army Flyer. I cannot remember which. I guess that makes me a bad student.

Eaker concluded that this war provided a poor test case for the application of strategic bombing. He believed the wide spread attacks against the population was the wrong approach. Eaker argued that using air power as a blunt instrument against the Ethiopians worked, because they did not possess an industrialized economy. In his opinion, the application of high level precision bombing could not be proven against a country like Ethiopia.

This provides another reason why the Ethiopian War should be studied. American airmen dismissed it. A European power faced off against what was believed to be an inferior opponent in Ethiopia. Decades later the United States Air Force found itself engaged in a war against a similar opponent in Vietnam.

With that said, does anyone know of any books published about the Italian application of air power in the Ethiopian War?

]]> By: jimmypete http://www.historynet.com/ugly-a-last-note-on-the-ethiopian-campaign.htm#comment-821146 jimmypete Sun, 14 Oct 2012 19:29:07 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/?p=13686887#comment-821146 Thank you for your email. Though there are some interesting books on specific aspects of the Italian Military in English , none are comprehensive or by a recognized historian, except for Jack Greene's work on the Italian navy. So many aspects of World War II have been written about, I believe that this is a subject that should be covered, as the last few living veterans are dying out, we are losing an invaluable resource. For that matter enough with the oft covered battles how bout, some of the lesser aspects of the War, the Hungarian army's turn about, the Rumanian participation on the Eastern Front. The campaigns between the British and Vichy forces [few Americans know that the first American battles in the West were against the French]. Thank you for your email. Though there are some interesting books on specific aspects of the Italian Military in English , none are comprehensive or by a recognized historian, except for Jack Greene's work on the Italian navy. So many aspects of World War II have been written about, I believe that this is a subject that should be covered, as the last few living veterans are dying out, we are losing an invaluable resource. For that matter enough with the oft covered battles how bout, some of the lesser aspects of the War, the Hungarian army's turn about, the Rumanian participation on the Eastern Front. The campaigns between the British and Vichy forces [few Americans know that the first American battles in the West were against the French].

]]> By: Rob Citino http://www.historynet.com/ugly-a-last-note-on-the-ethiopian-campaign.htm#comment-821133 Rob Citino Sun, 14 Oct 2012 16:51:55 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/?p=13686887#comment-821133 I agree with every word, jimmypete. That has been the point I've been trying to make in the last three posts (and at earlier points in writing this blog). Any analysis of World War II in Europe that does not take the Italians seriously is missing a very big piece of the puzzle. --RC I agree with every word, jimmypete. That has been the point I've been trying to make in the last three posts (and at earlier points in writing this blog). Any analysis of World War II in Europe that does not take the Italians seriously is missing a very big piece of the puzzle. –RC

]]> By: jimmypete http://www.historynet.com/ugly-a-last-note-on-the-ethiopian-campaign.htm#comment-821081 jimmypete Sun, 14 Oct 2012 03:12:03 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/?p=13686887#comment-821081 One other aspect of Italy's Army deserves some study. In East Africa, the Savoia Division along with other units, held off a British-Indian Army at the battle of Keren,in a stand that was described by British officers as equal to Monte Cassino. Also Italian Cavalry in East Africa and Russia, pulled off insane feats, that out do the myths of Polish Lancers in 1939 [I'm not denigrating the brave Polish Army's stance, but it is pretty well accepted that the lances vs. Tanks stories weren't true, maybe the Poles were too smart for that, in Russia and Keren Italian Cavalry did attack mechanized units with some success. ] One other aspect of Italy's Army deserves some study. In East Africa, the Savoia Division along with other units, held off a British-Indian Army at the battle of Keren,in a stand that was described by British officers as equal to Monte Cassino. Also Italian Cavalry in East Africa and Russia, pulled off insane feats, that out do the myths of Polish Lancers in 1939 [I'm not denigrating the brave Polish Army's stance, but it is pretty well accepted that the lances vs. Tanks stories weren't true, maybe the Poles were too smart for that, in Russia and Keren Italian Cavalry did attack mechanized units with some success. ]

]]> By: jimmypete http://www.historynet.com/ugly-a-last-note-on-the-ethiopian-campaign.htm#comment-821079 jimmypete Sun, 14 Oct 2012 03:03:43 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/?p=13686887#comment-821079 While I agree with your analysis of the Ethiopian war and Italian fecklessness in that war, Your description of Italian troops as clowns in World War 11, has been refuted by much recent scholarship. No one would argue that the Italian Army was a first rate army, but given the disabilities of Italian industrial capacity, poor equipment, the lack of real national interest in the war, and Mussolini's insistence in trying to emulate Hitler spreading his limited forces thin trying to fight in Africa, Yugoslavia, Greece and , most inexplicable, Russia, the Italian Army produced some admirable fighting units. The Alpini were one of the few units to fight out of the Stalingrad debacle. The Folgore were as good as any German unit in Egypt, the Sam Marino marine unit fought excellently in Tunisia, as did the Young Fascists. The Ariete armored division with out classed tanks, was respected by both sides. The Italian navy after initial setbacks fulfilled it's primary mission of keeping the Italo-German forces supplied. The naval historian Jack Greene , who specializes in the Mediterranean War, says that right up to the entry of the Americans, the Italian Navy did more than expected from a strategic point, and Italian special naval special forces were probably the best in the War. While I agree with your analysis of the Ethiopian war and Italian fecklessness in that war, Your description of Italian troops as clowns in World War 11, has been refuted by much recent scholarship. No one would argue that the Italian Army was a first rate army, but given the disabilities of Italian industrial capacity, poor equipment, the lack of real national interest in the war, and Mussolini's insistence in trying to emulate Hitler spreading his limited forces thin trying to fight in Africa, Yugoslavia, Greece and , most inexplicable, Russia, the Italian Army produced some admirable fighting units. The Alpini were one of the few units to fight out of the Stalingrad debacle. The Folgore were as good as any German unit in Egypt, the Sam Marino marine unit fought excellently in Tunisia, as did the Young Fascists. The Ariete armored division with out classed tanks, was respected by both sides. The Italian navy after initial setbacks fulfilled it's primary mission of keeping the Italo-German forces supplied. The naval historian Jack Greene , who specializes in the Mediterranean War, says that right up to the entry of the Americans, the Italian Navy did more than expected from a strategic point, and Italian special naval special forces were probably the best in the War.

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