Comments on: Turning the Ottoman Tide - John III Sobieski at Vienna 1683 http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm From the World's Largest History Magazine Publisher Mon, 22 Mar 2010 04:28:06 -0400 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: Artur M http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm/comment-page-1#comment-193290 Artur M Sun, 14 Feb 2010 06:29:10 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm#comment-193290 Interesting article however poor on the vital contribution of Polish King Sobieski, his tactical decisions, application of forces under this command and their distribution as well as the decisive Polish Cavalry Winged Hussars', Austrian and German cavalry impact on the battle. Polish Hussars were leading the charge and as such were at the front of the charge and were followed by the armoured and light Austrian and German cavalry units. The charge had an awesome impact causing the enemy to be able to fire only one salvo of musket and cannon fire at the charging cavalry under the command of the Polish King Sobieski. Within minutes a force of almost 20,000 allied cavalry (in that 2500 Polish Hussars leading the charge) charged at the enemy forces. Polish Hussars clashed so heavily with the enemy that only twenty of Polish Winged Hussars out of the whole force managed to retain unbroken lances. Even today, the captured Turkish tent http://www.blogi.szkolazklasa.pl/privefiles/blog-1993/namiot_turecki.jpg amongst other items captured by the Polish Hussars is displayed at the Wawel Royal Castle in Poland. Pope Innocent XI, presented the Polish king with a CONSECRATED SWORD. This sword was given to King Jan III in the cathedral in ?ó?kiew in 1684, as a sign of gratitude for the protection of Christendom against the Turks. Check this link to see the image of it: http://www.wawel.krakow.pl/en/index.php?op=21 To sum it up: the whole article really was not about King Sobieski's achievement as it only dedicated few final paragraphs to the Polish King's victory in this decisive battle. In Vienna, I believe, there is now a statue erected to the memory of Polish King Sobieski, his rescue of Vienna and his decisive victory over the enemy forces. Interesting article however poor on the vital contribution of Polish King Sobieski, his tactical decisions, application of forces under this command and their distribution as well as the decisive Polish Cavalry Winged Hussars', Austrian and German cavalry impact on the battle. Polish Hussars were leading the charge and as such were at the front of the charge and were followed by the armoured and light Austrian and German cavalry units. The charge had an awesome impact causing the enemy to be able to fire only one salvo of musket and cannon fire at the charging cavalry under the command of the Polish King Sobieski. Within minutes a force of almost 20,000 allied cavalry (in that 2500 Polish Hussars leading the charge) charged at the enemy forces. Polish Hussars clashed so heavily with the enemy that only twenty of Polish Winged Hussars out of the whole force managed to retain unbroken lances. Even today, the captured Turkish tent
http://www.blogi.szkolazklasa.pl/privefiles/blog-1993/namiot_turecki.jpg
amongst other items captured by the Polish Hussars is displayed at the Wawel Royal Castle in Poland.
Pope Innocent XI, presented the Polish king with a CONSECRATED SWORD. This sword was given to King Jan III in the cathedral in ?ó?kiew in 1684, as a sign of gratitude for the protection of Christendom against the Turks. Check this link to see the image of it:
http://www.wawel.krakow.pl/en/index.php?op=21
To sum it up: the whole article really was not about King Sobieski's achievement as it only dedicated few final paragraphs to the Polish King's victory in this decisive battle. In Vienna, I believe, there is now a statue erected to the memory of Polish King Sobieski, his rescue of Vienna and his decisive victory over the enemy forces.

]]> By: John Riggs http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm/comment-page-1#comment-75903 John Riggs Sat, 13 Jun 2009 11:01:21 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm#comment-75903 The article was very good and covered most of the better information available. I was recently in Constantinople and it is still in ruins. The city has not been taken care of but there is a newer movement to clean it up to bring in Western Tourists. The history there is directed towards Islam and how wonderfully it changed everything for the better there and not Christianity. You need to study the facts before you go to Constantinople and Vienne and this article will help in that regard. Sadly, the Janissary core did betray their own families also. Don Juan of Austria, Eugene of Savoy (Austrian General) and King John III Sobieski of Poland and the emperor’s brother-in-law, Charles Sixte of Lorraine should all be given much more credit for what they did for the West. World wide historical kudos should still be showered on Sobieski for his decision to march through the Wienerwald to catch the Turks off guard. There is a church and lookout on that hill now to honor this. The uneducated public does not realize that the Muslims are still at the Gates of Vienna and the West has thrown those gates open to the good people to come in for jobs but the bad are also slithering in under their shoes into the European Union. This article is good in historical context of the times. Yes, Turkey proudly announces that it is .99 % Muslim and open to the West. The article was very good and covered most of the better information available. I was recently in Constantinople and it is still in ruins. The city has not been taken care of but there is a newer movement to clean it up to bring in Western Tourists.

The history there is directed towards Islam and how wonderfully it changed everything for the better there and not Christianity. You need to study the facts before you go to Constantinople and Vienne and this article will help in that regard. Sadly, the Janissary core did betray their own families also.

Don Juan of Austria, Eugene of Savoy (Austrian General) and King John III Sobieski of Poland and the emperor’s brother-in-law, Charles Sixte of Lorraine should all be given much more credit for what they did for the West. World wide historical kudos should still be showered on Sobieski for his decision to march through the Wienerwald to catch the Turks off guard. There is a church and lookout on that hill now to honor this.

The uneducated public does not realize that the Muslims are still at the Gates of Vienna and the West has thrown those gates open to the good people to come in for jobs but the bad are also slithering in under their shoes into the European Union.
This article is good in historical context of the times. Yes,
Turkey proudly announces that it is .99 % Muslim and open to the West.

]]> By: Clarence J. LaFuentes II http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm/comment-page-1#comment-75466 Clarence J. LaFuentes II Fri, 12 Jun 2009 21:48:39 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm#comment-75466 I thank you for this article. I appreciate an honest historian. The article complaining about calling some of the Muslim men of the year(s) mentioned want to candy coat reality. I realize with the heat of battle/caught up in the moment men on both sides of a battle may over due their anger. The reason we have enjoyed our living style(s) and history is in thanks to the monks (scriptoria), Benedictines e.g., and the Roman Catholic men and women who stood in the breach and fought and/or shed their blood; both secular/laity and the Knights .g. St. Johns Hospitalliers, the Knights of St. Peter Alcantara etc... Read William Thomas Walsh book's "Isabella the Catholic of Spain" and "Phillip II". This is why the Roman Catholic church that is being preserved with the Latin mass is right. We will need our faith and will be shedding blood. I believe there is another group of a different faith that is instigating this, too. As in the case of what we have seen since 1948. Palestine until then, 1948 and even before the 1920's with the British helping with a settlement, was quiet. The Palestinians, both Christian and Arab, are right in their grievance. Christus Vincit, Christus Regnat, Christus Imperat I thank you for this article. I appreciate an honest historian. The article complaining about calling some of the Muslim men of the year(s) mentioned want to candy coat reality. I realize with the heat of battle/caught up in the moment men on both sides of a battle may over due their anger. The reason we have enjoyed our living style(s) and history is in thanks to the monks (scriptoria), Benedictines e.g., and the Roman Catholic men and women who stood in the breach and fought and/or shed their blood; both secular/laity and the Knights .g. St. Johns Hospitalliers, the Knights of St. Peter Alcantara etc…
Read William Thomas Walsh book's "Isabella the Catholic of Spain" and "Phillip II". This is why the Roman Catholic church that is being preserved with the Latin mass is right. We will need our faith and will be shedding blood. I believe there is another group of a different faith that is instigating this, too. As in the case of what we have seen since 1948.
Palestine until then, 1948 and even before the 1920's with the British helping with a settlement, was quiet.
The Palestinians, both Christian and Arab, are right in their grievance.
Christus Vincit, Christus Regnat, Christus Imperat

]]> By: Bob Sayers http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm/comment-page-1#comment-66235 Bob Sayers Wed, 27 May 2009 17:41:46 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm#comment-66235 I thought that the article (which was, indeed, taken from a much larger work) was immense in its coverage of a hugh piece of history. BUT, I missed a better description of the heroic deeds of John III, particularly his cavalry, whic h played such an important tole in the salvation of the West. I thought that the article (which was, indeed, taken from a much larger work) was immense in its coverage of a hugh piece of history. BUT, I missed a better description of the heroic deeds of John III, particularly his cavalry, whic h played such an important tole in the salvation of the West.

]]> By: Tom Sontag http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm/comment-page-1#comment-31200 Tom Sontag Sat, 31 Jan 2009 16:37:06 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm#comment-31200 Nicely written article. It would have been reasonable to remind readers that Janissaries were mostly Christian children, forcably taken from Christian families in conquered regions, brought up by Muslims under conditions of religious manipulation, converted to Islam when they came of age, then sent out with zeal to commit Jihads against Christians. The Janissary core was one of many methods used by Muslims to convert the Middle East and North Africa to Islam. Nicely written article.

It would have been reasonable to remind readers that Janissaries were mostly Christian children, forcably taken from Christian families in conquered regions, brought up by Muslims under conditions of religious manipulation, converted to Islam when they came of age, then sent out with zeal to commit Jihads against Christians.

The Janissary core was one of many methods used by Muslims to convert the Middle East and North Africa to Islam.

]]> By: Bob Sandusky http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm/comment-page-1#comment-23903 Bob Sandusky Fri, 26 Dec 2008 22:25:34 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm#comment-23903 I think the article is a decent overview of the ottoman empire trending upward and then its decline but the title is all wrong. It should have stopped at "Turning the Ottoman Tide" for in reality what did it mention the battle of Vienna for? 4 paragraphs? I think the article is a decent overview of the ottoman empire trending upward and then its decline but the title is all wrong. It should have stopped at "Turning the Ottoman Tide" for in reality what did it mention the battle of Vienna for? 4 paragraphs?

]]> By: third world county » “The voices, the voices… “ http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm/comment-page-1#comment-14567 third world county » “The voices, the voices… “ Tue, 21 Oct 2008 14:13:25 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm#comment-14567 [...] I know a decent, honorable politician (which also means not necessarily the sharpest tool in the shed, but a nice guy. Surprise, surprise. One. He recently said to my wife–some meeting with her teachers’ group–that if Obama won the election, he might just have to leave the country (as well might we all, juuuust ahead of the Obamassiah’s Brownshirt Brigade). I told her the next time she saw him to refer him to this. At least that country has a history of resistance to cultural destruction. [...] [...] I know a decent, honorable politician (which also means not necessarily the sharpest tool in the shed, but a nice guy. Surprise, surprise. One. He recently said to my wife–some meeting with her teachers' group–that if Obama won the election, he might just have to leave the country (as well might we all, juuuust ahead of the Obamassiah's Brownshirt Brigade). I told her the next time she saw him to refer him to this. At least that country has a history of resistance to cultural destruction. [...]

]]> By: Bartosz http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm/comment-page-1#comment-10357 Bartosz Sun, 07 Sep 2008 08:21:18 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm#comment-10357 These days, September 2008 we have 325 anniversary of this battle. You can discuss this battle at the historynet.com forum: http://www.armchairgeneral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67411 These days, September 2008 we have 325 anniversary of this battle. You can discuss this battle at the historynet.com forum:

http://www.armchairgeneral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67411

]]> By: Murphy Maloney http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm/comment-page-1#comment-7809 Murphy Maloney Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:33:17 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm#comment-7809 Great article, very informative. Gives a great overview of a serious subject that resonates today in America's so called "War on Terror" Great article, very informative. Gives a great overview of a serious subject that resonates today in America's so called "War on Terror"

]]> By: Mete Han http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm/comment-page-1#comment-5164 Mete Han Mon, 11 Aug 2008 10:11:29 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/turning-the-ottoman-tide-john-iii-sobieski-at-vienna-1683.htm#comment-5164 I think this article is not that objective. It has gone too far about looting and calling muslims as barbarians. I think this article is not that objective. It has gone too far about looting and calling muslims as barbarians.

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