Comments on: The Worst Battlefield Blunders: Five Battles That Ended Badly http://www.historynet.com/the-worst-battlefield-blunders-five-battles-that-ended-badly.htm?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=the-worst-battlefield-blunders-five-battles-that-ended-badly From the World's Largest History Magazine Publisher Wed, 15 Feb 2012 04:36:36 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3 By: Dennis http://www.historynet.com/the-worst-battlefield-blunders-five-battles-that-ended-badly.htm#comment-788657 Dennis Thu, 09 Feb 2012 15:59:35 +0000 #comment-788657 @ Debauchee69 : You obviously have never served a day in uniform and are speaking from a very biased 'education'. First, whatever you are reading and your belief that infantry fights are thing of the past has been repeated and dispelled a thousand times over in history. Todays fights are as much an example of that as any other. If you think drones shooting missiles are accomplishing anything but headlines, you need to get out of your parents basement. Those drones are usually called in by reconaissance units or infantry. Drones cant do a house to house search, drones dont take and hold ground, drones cant go in a cave. As to 8 year olds beating real pilots, thats the same as boasting that some paintball squad beat a real army / Marine unit. Its real easy to win when your tactics and 'game' doesnt involve real death. Its real easy to ask a guy to make a 'suicide' mission if at the end of the 'game' he can get back up. Marine/Army REAL tactics are based on REAL war, so yeah, an 8 year old who is fine with sacrificing 'fake' men and aircraft will likely beat a unit / person thats using REAL tactics that WORK in REAL war. @ Debauchee69 :
You obviously have never served a day in uniform and are speaking from a very biased 'education'.
First, whatever you are reading and your belief that infantry fights are thing of the past has been repeated and dispelled a thousand times over in history. Todays fights are as much an example of that as any other. If you think drones shooting missiles are accomplishing anything but headlines, you need to get out of your parents basement. Those drones are usually called in by reconaissance units or infantry. Drones cant do a house to house search, drones dont take and hold ground, drones cant go in a cave.
As to 8 year olds beating real pilots, thats the same as boasting that some paintball squad beat a real army / Marine unit. Its real easy to win when your tactics and 'game' doesnt involve real death. Its real easy to ask a guy to make a 'suicide' mission if at the end of the 'game' he can get back up. Marine/Army REAL tactics are based on REAL war, so yeah, an 8 year old who is fine with sacrificing 'fake' men and aircraft will likely beat a unit / person thats using REAL tactics that WORK in REAL war.

]]> By: Stephen http://www.historynet.com/the-worst-battlefield-blunders-five-battles-that-ended-badly.htm#comment-784986 Stephen Wed, 21 Dec 2011 02:04:38 +0000 #comment-784986 Did the author write for Cracked Magazine? Why is this poorly written drivel on this site? Did the author write for Cracked Magazine? Why is this poorly written drivel on this site?

]]> By: Vincent http://www.historynet.com/the-worst-battlefield-blunders-five-battles-that-ended-badly.htm#comment-781367 Vincent Mon, 14 Nov 2011 19:57:42 +0000 #comment-781367 All true except the "more aircraft" part. The RAF had only a handful of Hurricanes at the time of the defeat. They had just lost the Prince of Wales and Repulse due to lack of air cover. Their defensive advantages were squandered by Percival by spreading his troops thin. And then to surrender despite Churchill's insistence ... there wasn't much chance for re-enforcement and supply for the Japanese, so the British certainly could/should have fought an effective battle of attrition - what an enormous embarrassment. All true except the "more aircraft" part. The RAF had only a handful of Hurricanes at the time of the defeat. They had just lost the Prince of Wales and Repulse due to lack of air cover.

Their defensive advantages were squandered by Percival by spreading his troops thin. And then to surrender despite Churchill's insistence … there wasn't much chance for re-enforcement and supply for the Japanese, so the British certainly could/should have fought an effective battle of attrition – what an enormous embarrassment.

]]> By: John http://www.historynet.com/the-worst-battlefield-blunders-five-battles-that-ended-badly.htm#comment-780387 John Wed, 02 Nov 2011 15:35:24 +0000 #comment-780387 Lincoln probably didn't support the Mexican war because he knew the underlying provocation was entirely invented by Polk as a land grab. Much like those who voted against the Iraq War because they saw no real strategic or geopolitical gain was to be acheived by it let alone justified by shaky intel. Lincoln was not a hippy pacifist. He was a pragmatist. A hippy pacifist would have let the southern states break off and done nothing. A hippy pacifist would not have put a man like Grant in charge of his armies, he would have remained happy with a useless dawdler like Mac, or a blunderer like Burnside, or a tactical noob like Hooker. Lincoln understood the primary purpose of his administration was to reunite the nation. he had to destory half of it first, but after the war sought to make a peaceful, magnanimous transition. Thanks to Booth, we got stuck with Johnson, which ironically meant even greater hardship for the south, and was followed by their subsequent reaction. Thanks John Wilkes...should've kept your day job. Lincoln probably didn't support the Mexican war because he knew the underlying provocation was entirely invented by Polk as a land grab. Much like those who voted against the Iraq War because they saw no real strategic or geopolitical gain was to be acheived by it let alone justified by shaky intel. Lincoln was not a hippy pacifist. He was a pragmatist. A hippy pacifist would have let the southern states break off and done nothing. A hippy pacifist would not have put a man like Grant in charge of his armies, he would have remained happy with a useless dawdler like Mac, or a blunderer like Burnside, or a tactical noob like Hooker. Lincoln understood the primary purpose of his administration was to reunite the nation. he had to destory half of it first, but after the war sought to make a peaceful, magnanimous transition. Thanks to Booth, we got stuck with Johnson, which ironically meant even greater hardship for the south, and was followed by their subsequent reaction. Thanks John Wilkes…should've kept your day job.

]]> By: Tony M. Kennedy http://www.historynet.com/the-worst-battlefield-blunders-five-battles-that-ended-badly.htm#comment-779069 Tony M. Kennedy Fri, 07 Oct 2011 16:16:28 +0000 #comment-779069 The German high command decided to attack Verdun as a way to bleed the French white. The Germans never intended to take it, on many occassions German rifle platoons and companies called back when they could have been used as reinforcements to exploit a gap made in the French lines at Verdun. In the end Verdun bled the Germans white, although you could argue that the German's poliotcal-military leadership decision to bled the French white at Verdun was just as bad. The German high command decided to attack Verdun as a way to bleed the French white. The Germans never intended to take it, on many occassions German rifle platoons and companies called back when they could have been used as reinforcements to exploit a gap made in the French lines at Verdun. In the end Verdun bled the Germans white, although you could argue that the German's poliotcal-military leadership decision to bled the French white at Verdun was just as bad.

]]> By: Debauchee69 http://www.historynet.com/the-worst-battlefield-blunders-five-battles-that-ended-badly.htm#comment-574942 Debauchee69 Fri, 27 May 2011 05:06:10 +0000 #comment-574942 Mr. Lightfoot: We cracked Saadam's cordon defenses in T+96hrs after GEN Swartzkofpt did the bootleg left end run abound the desert. Like the Germans before Moscow or Eisenhower before Berlin---we could have gone in there with a bus load of Dallas Cheerleaders BUT FOR TURKEY which pitched a bitch and threatening to disrupt the Coalition because they were more afraid of the Kurds taking over Iraq that Saadam was---and he gassed them!!! And as for your comments that unless you walked the walk of an 11B, you ain't a warrior---that is so Neianderthal!!! Look it up, 1/3 of all air missions over Iraq/Lybia/Pakistan/Yemen/Iran/Saudi Arabia/etc., etc. are Preditor/Raptor or recon missions. Those are flown by 30 somethings sitting in an air conditioned 18 wheeler in the midwest/bible belt who grab their coffee at 0700hrs, play their kid's video games FOR REAL and then go home and play hump the wife at 1800hrs (or whatever shift they're on). Goin' at it Mano-Y-Mano with a soldier is now a relic of the past. Did you know Pres George W. Bush is a stone cold Killah? He asked if he could push a button on a terrorist driving in a convoy in Yemen and he lauched the missle that offed the little sh*t!!! That is the new Paradyme of soldiering. Killing someone remotely and then going out and ordering Pizza for your daughter's soccer team fifteen minutes later. I'm actually writing a paper on the subject THE CHILD WARRIOR (1606-2014) AMERICA'S PROUD PAST; AMERICA'S NEW FUTURE. There have been studies where 30 something pilots went up against 8 year old playing video games and the 8 year olds CREAMED the pilots at 1/10000th the training and cost. Can America afford to the country at risk because it clings to its outdated chivary of prohibiting the employment of Children Warriors? Inquiring minds want to know!!! GENERALS DON'T START WARS; POLITICIANS DO---that's the way is has been since 10,000BC and the way it will be 10,000AD; Deal with it!!! As a soldier, you are nothing but Toilet Paper---the instrument by which the Politicians and ruling classes impose their will!!! Always been that way; Always will be that way. Oh Well!!! Mr. Lightfoot:

We cracked Saadam's cordon defenses in T+96hrs after GEN Swartzkofpt did the bootleg left end run abound the desert. Like the Germans before Moscow or Eisenhower before Berlin—we could have gone in there with a bus load of Dallas Cheerleaders BUT FOR TURKEY which pitched a bitch and threatening to disrupt the Coalition because they were more afraid of the Kurds taking over Iraq that Saadam was—and he gassed them!!!

And as for your comments that unless you walked the walk of an 11B, you ain't a warrior—that is so Neianderthal!!! Look it up, 1/3 of all air missions over Iraq/Lybia/Pakistan/Yemen/Iran/Saudi Arabia/etc., etc. are Preditor/Raptor or recon missions. Those are flown by 30 somethings sitting in an air conditioned 18 wheeler in the midwest/bible belt who grab their coffee at 0700hrs, play their kid's video games FOR REAL and then go home and play hump the wife at 1800hrs (or whatever shift they're on). Goin' at it Mano-Y-Mano with a soldier is now a relic of the past. Did you know Pres George W. Bush is a stone cold Killah? He asked if he could push a button on a terrorist driving in a convoy in Yemen and he lauched the missle that offed the little sh*t!!! That is the new Paradyme of soldiering. Killing someone remotely and then going out and ordering Pizza for your daughter's soccer team fifteen minutes later.

I'm actually writing a paper on the subject THE CHILD WARRIOR (1606-2014) AMERICA'S PROUD PAST; AMERICA'S NEW FUTURE. There have been studies where 30 something pilots went up against 8 year old playing video games and the 8 year olds CREAMED the pilots at 1/10000th the training and cost. Can America afford to the country at risk because it clings to its outdated chivary of prohibiting the employment of Children Warriors? Inquiring minds want to know!!!

GENERALS DON'T START WARS; POLITICIANS DO—that's the way is has been since 10,000BC and the way it will be 10,000AD; Deal with it!!! As a soldier, you are nothing but Toilet Paper—the instrument by which the Politicians and ruling classes impose their will!!! Always been that way; Always will be that way. Oh Well!!!

]]> By: Debauchee69 http://www.historynet.com/the-worst-battlefield-blunders-five-battles-that-ended-badly.htm#comment-574913 Debauchee69 Fri, 27 May 2011 04:28:51 +0000 #comment-574913 On the battle of Detroit: I DO NOT FEAR RETALIATION FROM BIN LADIN or Al Queda, Nor does America the Taliban. AMERICA DID NOT FEAR ADOLF HITLER AND HIS NAZI GOONS NOR DID AMERICA FEAR THE KAISER. The only people I fear is them DAMN CANADIANS!!! First we tried to liberate Canada in 1775 by capturing Quebec and Montreal and they kick our ass back to America. It it wasn't for the efforts of GEN Arnold, America would be drinking Canadian Club instead of the fine Bourbon I have in my glass as I type this (hence all the Typos and Errors) Then we go back to Canada in 1812 and teach them bastards a REAL LESSON!!! This is what happens to you HOSEHEADS when you mess with THE BEST!!! The Canadians take Chicago (Dearborn), Detroit and Queenstone and throw us out into the street like a common drunkard. Now they got is M-A-D---we go over to Canada AGAIN and burn their Povincial Capital York to the ground. They roll up their sleeves, go down to Washington D.C., drink up all our licqour, mess around with our women folk and burn the White House and a bunch of other buildings down and then leave. Filthy Soccer Hooligans!!! The trauma the Canadians inflicted upon America is still felt today. When ever we Americans Invade Canada, as a courtesy, we always by something (cigarettes, prescription medicines, massages) because we don't want to get them crazy MOFO's angry!!! On the battle of Detroit:

I DO NOT FEAR RETALIATION FROM BIN LADIN or Al Queda, Nor does America the Taliban. AMERICA DID NOT FEAR ADOLF HITLER AND HIS NAZI GOONS NOR DID AMERICA FEAR THE KAISER.

The only people I fear is them DAMN CANADIANS!!! First we tried to liberate Canada in 1775 by capturing Quebec and Montreal and they kick our ass back to America. It it wasn't for the efforts of GEN Arnold, America would be drinking Canadian Club instead of the fine Bourbon I have in my glass as I type this (hence all the Typos and Errors)

Then we go back to Canada in 1812 and teach them bastards a REAL LESSON!!! This is what happens to you HOSEHEADS when you mess with THE BEST!!! The Canadians take Chicago (Dearborn), Detroit and Queenstone and throw us out into the street like a common drunkard.

Now they got is M-A-D—we go over to Canada AGAIN and burn their Povincial Capital York to the ground. They roll up their sleeves, go down to Washington D.C., drink up all our licqour, mess around with our women folk and burn the White House and a bunch of other buildings down and then leave. Filthy Soccer Hooligans!!!

The trauma the Canadians inflicted upon America is still felt today. When ever we Americans Invade Canada, as a courtesy, we always by something (cigarettes, prescription medicines, massages) because we don't want to get them crazy MOFO's angry!!!

]]> By: Debauchee69 http://www.historynet.com/the-worst-battlefield-blunders-five-battles-that-ended-badly.htm#comment-574899 Debauchee69 Fri, 27 May 2011 04:05:02 +0000 #comment-574899 People, we are getting off track commenting about the US Presidents; this is about the FIVE GREATEST MILITARY MODERN SCREW-UPS with Consequences. (1800-2011) ADOWA 1896 Italy v. Ethiopia. Agreed!!! GEN Baratieri won the battle without fighting it (starving Menelik II into submission) but then lost the battle without first engaging the Ethopians by executing a stupid night assault without proper intel of the ground or opposing forces. TSUSHIMA (1905). Japan v. Russia The destruction of the Russian Fleet was needless, given the predicament of the Russian Fleet in Port Arthur. Had Kirpatkin been allowed to implement his sound defence/offense strategy, the war might not have turned out the way it did. ANUAL (1921) Spanish v. Arabs GEN Silvestre allowed KRIM to hit him on the flanks just like Hannibal did Flaminius at the Battle of Lake Transimene---20K soldiers killed!!! (TIE) SINGAPORE (1942) British Empire v. Japan. (TIE) FRANCE (1940) Allies v. Germany There was no excuse for the Fall of Singapore except for it being under the command of GEN Percival, the WORST GEN OF WWII. The British had 2-1 troops and 2-1 aircraft and were on the defensive AND LOST. The RAF's inability to fly air cover for HMS Prince of Wales/HMS Repulse was inexcusable. There was less excuse for failour for France. Hitler foolishly attacked with 1-2 odds armour (2/3d of it toys else junk Chez stuff) and 1-2 personnel and won?!!! Had Hitler stuck with the original 1939 Plan Yellow (the dash to the channel ports from Belgium, the French would have crush the German Armies before they got to Antwerp. At the last minute, the Germans approved the Schwerepunct to Sedan and caught the Allies flat footed. What killed it for the Allies was planning for the Dyle Plan AND the Breta Varient---which weakened the already weak 2& 9 Corps in the area. FYI, in the 1938 war games, GEN Corap simulated the German attack from the Ardenes to the Sedan bridges AND PIERCED the French Defenses---the move was dis-allowed by Gamelin because 'the Bosch wouldn't act like that'!!! DETROIT (1812) British/Canadians/Indian Confederacy v. United States of America. GEN Sir Isaac Brock is in a bad way. He is almost out of supplies, he has less than 200 Red Coat Regulars, 500 militia and 600 Indian allies and is caught in a pincher between two American Armies of approximately 6,000 troops, evenly divided. So what do you do? Offer terms to the Americans at Detroit and after a small demonstration, they surrender. Then what do you do, CDR? Surround BG William Hull's 2,500 soldiers with your 400 best troops and tell the Indians to encircle the Americans, banging pots and pans and their war drums. Then ask to Parley with BG Hull. "BG Hull, may I call you WIlliam? Look Bill, I've got you surrounded and I will guarentee your safety. However, remember the savages who roasted your men ALIVE at St. Clairs defeat in 1791. Well, one of Little Turtle's commanders there was Tecumseh and our Majesty has apparently made him a BG in our Army. Bill, you can surrender now and we'll all sing Beatles songs around the camp fires or Tecumseh gets ahold of your men and you all sing Indian songs "IN THE CAMPFIRE"!!! Give me your sword, Billy and you and your men live!! And so BG William Hull surrendered his 2,500 man command to 400 British and Indian troops at 1-5 odds. President Monroe ordered BG Hull S-H-O-T, one of two US Flag officers charged under the Articles of War for a death sentence offense (the other being MG Jefferson Davis for shooting his superior officer after getting his face slapped). Because of BG Hulls Revolutionary War Service, he was pardoned and released. MG Davis was walked from his jail cell to his command tent and told to 'Get at them Rebs!!!" People, we are getting off track commenting about the US Presidents; this is about the FIVE GREATEST MILITARY MODERN SCREW-UPS with Consequences. (1800-2011)

ADOWA 1896 Italy v. Ethiopia. Agreed!!! GEN Baratieri won the battle without fighting it (starving Menelik II into submission) but then lost the battle without first engaging the Ethopians by executing a stupid night assault without proper intel of the ground or opposing forces.

TSUSHIMA (1905). Japan v. Russia The destruction of the Russian Fleet was needless, given the predicament of the Russian Fleet in Port Arthur. Had Kirpatkin been allowed to implement his sound defence/offense strategy, the war might not have turned out the way it did.

ANUAL (1921) Spanish v. Arabs GEN Silvestre allowed KRIM to hit him on the flanks just like Hannibal did Flaminius at the Battle of Lake Transimene—20K soldiers killed!!!

(TIE) SINGAPORE (1942) British Empire v. Japan.
(TIE) FRANCE (1940) Allies v. Germany

There was no excuse for the Fall of Singapore except for it being under the command of GEN Percival, the WORST GEN OF WWII. The British had 2-1 troops and 2-1 aircraft and were on the defensive AND LOST. The RAF's inability to fly air cover for HMS Prince of Wales/HMS Repulse was inexcusable.

There was less excuse for failour for France. Hitler foolishly attacked with 1-2 odds armour (2/3d of it toys else junk Chez stuff) and 1-2 personnel and won?!!! Had Hitler stuck with the original 1939 Plan Yellow (the dash to the channel ports from Belgium, the French would have crush the German Armies before they got to Antwerp. At the last minute, the Germans approved the Schwerepunct to Sedan and caught the Allies flat footed. What killed it for the Allies was planning for the Dyle Plan AND the Breta Varient—which weakened the already weak 2& 9 Corps in the area. FYI, in the 1938 war games, GEN Corap simulated the German attack from the Ardenes to the Sedan bridges AND PIERCED the French Defenses—the move was dis-allowed by Gamelin because 'the Bosch wouldn't act like that'!!!

DETROIT (1812) British/Canadians/Indian Confederacy v. United States of America. GEN Sir Isaac Brock is in a bad way. He is almost out of supplies, he has less than 200 Red Coat Regulars, 500 militia and 600 Indian allies and is caught in a pincher between two American Armies of approximately 6,000 troops, evenly divided. So what do you do? Offer terms to the Americans at Detroit and after a small demonstration, they surrender. Then what do you do, CDR? Surround BG William Hull's 2,500 soldiers with your 400 best troops and tell the Indians to encircle the Americans, banging pots and pans and their war drums. Then ask to Parley with BG Hull.

"BG Hull, may I call you WIlliam? Look Bill, I've got you surrounded and I will guarentee your safety. However, remember the savages who roasted your men ALIVE at St. Clairs defeat in 1791. Well, one of Little Turtle's commanders there was Tecumseh and our Majesty has apparently made him a BG in our Army. Bill, you can surrender now and we'll all sing Beatles songs around the camp fires or Tecumseh gets ahold of your men and you all sing Indian songs "IN THE CAMPFIRE"!!! Give me your sword, Billy and you and your men live!!

And so BG William Hull surrendered his 2,500 man command to 400 British and Indian troops at 1-5 odds. President Monroe ordered BG Hull S-H-O-T, one of two US Flag officers charged under the Articles of War for a death sentence offense (the other being MG Jefferson Davis for shooting his superior officer after getting his face slapped).
Because of BG Hulls Revolutionary War Service, he was pardoned and released. MG Davis was walked from his jail cell to his command tent and told to 'Get at them Rebs!!!"

]]> By: Debauchee69 http://www.historynet.com/the-worst-battlefield-blunders-five-battles-that-ended-badly.htm#comment-574818 Debauchee69 Fri, 27 May 2011 02:48:54 +0000 #comment-574818 You D-A-R-E include John Adams, the scumbag lawyer who got all the British Soldiers (Boston Massacre Fame) off with a wrist-slap? I wouldn't start giving Obama any high fives yet---although his going in on Bin Ladin with scant information was a ballsy move that I approve of. His handling of the Arab Spring is about as bad as Truman (our only known KKK Klansman president) dealing with the Russians at the close of WW2 You D-A-R-E include John Adams, the scumbag lawyer who got all the British Soldiers (Boston Massacre Fame) off with a wrist-slap?

I wouldn't start giving Obama any high fives yet—although his going in on Bin Ladin with scant information was a ballsy move that I approve of. His handling of the Arab Spring is about as bad as Truman (our only known KKK Klansman president) dealing with the Russians at the close of WW2

]]> By: Debauchee69 http://www.historynet.com/the-worst-battlefield-blunders-five-battles-that-ended-badly.htm#comment-574803 Debauchee69 Fri, 27 May 2011 02:34:09 +0000 #comment-574803 I will cut SIDEBURNS some slack on Fredricksberg---but not the Cretor or the MUD MARCH. The biggest culpret to the Union Cause was PRESIDENT LINCOLN, a hippy pacifist (voted against the Mexican War) who was put institutionalized in 1833. He had a great commander in GEN Scott and should have kept him in for the duration. Little Mac was like Von Stubin, a great organizer/ a horrid CDR. GEN Pope was too flghty and was only fit for command of Ft Lewis. Bernie knew how to plan but not implement "The night Lincoln was shot, he saw Burnsides in the audience and smirked "I see old 'Mutton-Chops' is taking in the theatre with me tonight. I will cut SIDEBURNS some slack on Fredricksberg—but not the Cretor or the MUD MARCH.

The biggest culpret to the Union Cause was PRESIDENT LINCOLN, a hippy pacifist (voted against the Mexican War) who was put institutionalized in 1833. He had a great commander in GEN Scott and should have kept him in for the duration. Little Mac was like Von Stubin, a great organizer/ a horrid CDR. GEN Pope was too flghty and was only fit for command of Ft Lewis. Bernie knew how to plan but not implement "The night Lincoln was shot, he saw Burnsides in the audience and smirked "I see old 'Mutton-Chops' is taking in the theatre with me tonight.

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