Comments on: Hollywood's War: Beginnings and Endings http://www.historynet.com/hollywoods-war-beginnings-and-endings.htm From the World's Largest History Magazine Publisher Wed, 22 May 2013 02:58:19 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: Jacob D. http://www.historynet.com/hollywoods-war-beginnings-and-endings.htm#comment-855888 Jacob D. Wed, 30 Jan 2013 23:51:12 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/?p=13687511#comment-855888 I love Das Boot. I know the depiction of bolts popping from the pressure is completely inaccurate. I know the author derided the crews reaction to depth charging as over the top (then again, I've read about one incident where a captain shot himself in the head during a depth charge attack, so even a veteran's testimony is representative of his experience.) But I still love that movie. The ending(spoilers) is just such a perfect way to end that film. The look on the Captain's face, watching the boat sink, knowing that after all their efforts, all those close escapes, he failed to bring his boat and crew home. In the end none of it mattered. It gets me every time. I guess my main point is that war movies vary quite a bit. You have a movie like Das Boot, which has a minimalist style, and you have movies like the Dirty Dozen and Kelley's Heroes, which are over the top 70's exploitation films that have no (and claim no) relation to actual events. I have a hard time putting those in the same category as Das Boot or Paths of Glory (which in reality is more of a courtroom drama) And you have the trash, Pearl Harbor, Werewolf Vixens of the SS, The Great Raid, Battle of the Bulge. Trashy, sappy, stupid, they run the full gamut of movie crimes. I think the key to being a happy historian is to take the good movies with a grain of salt and know what to look for to avoid the bad ones. It's hard to make a movie, and balance all the factors that make for an entertaining story. And don't watch Pearl Harbor if there is a screwdriver or fork anywhere within reach. You WILL try to lobotomize yourself. I love Das Boot. I know the depiction of bolts popping from the pressure is completely inaccurate. I know the author derided the crews reaction to depth charging as over the top (then again, I've read about one incident where a captain shot himself in the head during a depth charge attack, so even a veteran's testimony is representative of his experience.)
But I still love that movie. The ending(spoilers) is just such a perfect way to end that film. The look on the Captain's face, watching the boat sink, knowing that after all their efforts, all those close escapes, he failed to bring his boat and crew home. In the end none of it mattered. It gets me every time.
I guess my main point is that war movies vary quite a bit. You have a movie like Das Boot, which has a minimalist style, and you have movies like the Dirty Dozen and Kelley's Heroes, which are over the top 70's exploitation films that have no (and claim no) relation to actual events. I have a hard time putting those in the same category as Das Boot or Paths of Glory (which in reality is more of a courtroom drama)
And you have the trash, Pearl Harbor, Werewolf Vixens of the SS, The Great Raid, Battle of the Bulge. Trashy, sappy, stupid, they run the full gamut of movie crimes.
I think the key to being a happy historian is to take the good movies with a grain of salt and know what to look for to avoid the bad ones. It's hard to make a movie, and balance all the factors that make for an entertaining story. And don't watch Pearl Harbor if there is a screwdriver or fork anywhere within reach. You WILL try to lobotomize yourself.

]]> By: Sean Oliver http://www.historynet.com/hollywoods-war-beginnings-and-endings.htm#comment-830754 Sean Oliver Mon, 07 Jan 2013 01:43:48 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/?p=13687511#comment-830754 ...trying to figure out how to use this site's comment feature... …trying to figure out how to use this site's comment feature…

]]> By: Sean Oliver http://www.historynet.com/hollywoods-war-beginnings-and-endings.htm#comment-830751 Sean Oliver Mon, 07 Jan 2013 01:35:15 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/?p=13687511#comment-830751 Most war movies stink. A few great older ones: Battleground (1947? Dir William Wellman) A good holiday movie about a squad of grumbling, dirty, unshaven dogfaces from the 101st fighting in the fog around Bastogne at Christmastime, 1944. Killer 1940's cast; Van Johnston, James Whitmore, Hodiak, Montalban, etc. Low budget, high realism. Unusual to see frontline American soldiers portrayed by Hollywood looking so grubby and shabby so soon after the war. In other war movies, the actors are always clean shaven, well groomed, and act like movie stars rather than dogfaces who live and die in muddy holes, like this one. Paths Of Glory (1957? Dir Stanley Kubrick w Kirk Douglas) Stalag 17 (1960? Dir Billy Wilder w William Holden) About half of Wilder's movies are masterpieces; Double Indemnity, Lost Weekend, Some Like It Hot, Sunset Blvd, and this one. Patton (1970 Dir:Frank Shaeffer? Can't quite remember) You've seen it. If not, get a clue. Could've been even longer, to probe deeper into Patton's personality. Das Boot: (1980ish Dir Wolfgang Peterson) Speaking of longer movies, Das Boot is the best nerve-racking submarine movie hands down. I've seen the 2-hour US version when it hit theaters in 1980, and a later rented a 4-hour version in 1990. I found out that Das Boot was apparently filmed as an mini-series for German TV, and totals maybe 8-10 hours in its full length! How anybody's nerves could withstand 8 hours of this sitting on their sofa at home in one sitting is beyond me. But then try to imagine surviving 8 weeks(!) or more of the hellish 24-7 tension that sub crews REALLY endured, mission after mission..! Most war movies stink.

A few great older ones:

Battleground (1947? Dir William Wellman) A good holiday movie about a squad of grumbling, dirty, unshaven dogfaces from the 101st fighting in the fog around Bastogne at Christmastime, 1944. Killer 1940's cast; Van Johnston, James Whitmore, Hodiak, Montalban, etc. Low budget, high realism. Unusual to see frontline American soldiers portrayed by Hollywood looking so grubby and shabby so soon after the war. In other war movies, the actors are always clean shaven, well groomed, and act like movie stars rather than dogfaces who live and die in muddy holes, like this one.

Paths Of Glory (1957? Dir Stanley Kubrick w Kirk Douglas)

Stalag 17 (1960? Dir Billy Wilder w William Holden) About half of Wilder's movies are masterpieces; Double Indemnity, Lost Weekend, Some Like It Hot, Sunset Blvd, and this one.

Patton (1970 Dir:Frank Shaeffer? Can't quite remember) You've seen it. If not, get a clue. Could've been even longer, to probe deeper into Patton's personality.

Das Boot: (1980ish Dir Wolfgang Peterson) Speaking of longer movies, Das Boot is the best nerve-racking submarine movie hands down. I've seen the 2-hour US version when it hit theaters in 1980, and a later rented a 4-hour version in 1990. I found out that Das Boot was apparently filmed as an mini-series for German TV, and totals maybe 8-10 hours in its full length!
How anybody's nerves could withstand 8 hours of this sitting on their sofa at home in one sitting is beyond me. But then try to imagine surviving 8 weeks(!) or more of the hellish 24-7 tension that sub crews REALLY endured, mission after mission..!

]]> By: Tori Adams http://www.historynet.com/hollywoods-war-beginnings-and-endings.htm#comment-830490 Tori Adams Fri, 04 Jan 2013 23:50:31 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/?p=13687511#comment-830490 One seldom mentioned point is that Captain Von Trapp was a former U-boat commander and commander the boat that conducted the last sinking of an Allied ship in the Med in WWI - changes how you think of him doesn't it? One seldom mentioned point is that Captain Von Trapp was a former U-boat commander and commander the boat that conducted the last sinking of an Allied ship in the Med in WWI – changes how you think of him doesn't it?

]]> By: Rudy http://www.historynet.com/hollywoods-war-beginnings-and-endings.htm#comment-830298 Rudy Thu, 03 Jan 2013 04:38:04 +0000 http://www.historynet.com/?p=13687511#comment-830298 Being a retired military, I love war movies. The documentary films made by cameramen on scene are better. Not all war movies are good, just as in other class of films. My wife does not like war movies. Who cares what anybody likes. Just don't make an issue about it. I think Gone with the Wind and Les Miserables are some of the best films ever. I could name others that are at the top of the long list of films. I love Amazing Grace and the foreign film Babett's Feast. I have seen these several times, and will watch them many more times. Babett's Feast contrast legalism and grace and at the close the general speaks of mercy and truth, but how many people will pickup on these, or in Les Miserables pick out grace and judgement throughout the film. I love the 1956 version best. There are four or five versions. Being a retired military, I love war movies. The documentary films made by cameramen on scene are better. Not all war movies are
good, just as in other class of films. My wife does not like war movies. Who cares what anybody likes. Just don't make an issue about it. I think Gone with the Wind and Les Miserables are some of the best films ever. I could name others that are at the top of the long list of films. I love Amazing Grace and the foreign film Babett's Feast. I have seen these several times, and will watch them many more times. Babett's Feast contrast legalism and grace and at the close the general speaks of mercy and truth, but how many people will pickup on these, or in Les Miserables pick out grace and judgement throughout the film. I love the 1956 version best. There are four or five versions.

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